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glm38 wrote: I think you are joking aren't you? Nothing is perfect but IMO for the most part fans on this board have been pretty respectful of the Shockers dominance of the Valley the last few years. Not that any of the rest of us (or our teams) are going to roll over. But what's going on in Wichita right now is amazing and deserves that respect. And envy.

You are absolutely right glm. Honestly, it's hard to talk a lot of smack on WSU right now anyways. But seriously, most of the contributions have been good on this board. You are one of the best good contributors to the board no doubt.

I think by the same token WSU fans have handled themselves fairly well for the most part, given the success. I know a lot o teams in the past haven't handled it well with their one-year wonder seasons.

I just hate the blind poll thing altogether. Generally most people actually contribute meaningfully to the integrity of the poll. But there are a few posters out there who definitely fall under the criteria I outlined. But thankfully those are the ones that don't have the guts to initiate any discussion on here as they know they would get rolled. Hence to the fact we still have no takers on the "Evansville is gonna win the Valley" take.

To each their own though.

This WSU team is probably stronger than both the 18-0 team 2 years ago and the 17-1 team last year.

I'm not seeing a Valley team likely to make the "Others Receiving Votes" lists. WSU could be a top-10 team from pre-season to post-season.

UNI, Evansville, and IlSU will get a bit more national attention than normal as the media watches those games to see if any Valley teams can take WSU down.

I know that all teams have off nights and all teams have hot nights. Generally, if a better team has an off night when a lesser team has a hot night, the lesser team claims the W. I don't see that happening in Valley play.

I'm not seeing more than 2 losses for WSU going into the NCAA's. Maybe one in the early tournament and maybe one in the Valley tourney. The Valley tourney doesn't matter to WSU. Their spot in the NCAA's will be solid before the tourney. The Shox might not even be playing for seeding at Arch Madness. Resting the players may be more important than winning games. Arch Madness might be a great place to get the Fr some experience.

I remain hopeful that Marty cuts loose from his game coaching pattern, one that was developed when he had sparse talent so needed to rely on a constant motion offense to free up "the" shooter, along with scratch, bump, and hold defense, just to try to stay competitive. It worked to a certain extent, but it is not a winning strategy, it is a survival strategy, not one to use when you actually have several talented players. I may be delusional but I think Marty might actually utilize his whole team's strengths this year and not hold them back. The Valley needs Evansville to rise to its potential this year and really be good. Probably not going to see another UNI type level performance, but if they could come close to that--and the talent is there to do it--that would make for at least a sliver of a chance that the Conference gets a second bid again. That would make most of us very happy. I for one don't want the Valley to be a one team show case ala Gonzaga, even if that team is my Shockers. I want my team to kick worthy asses in conference play, as well as suffer the occasional instructional loss from a ranked Valley opponent. Evansville, ISUR&B, UNI, Loyola, I'm talkin' to you and anybody else willing to make the kind of effort necessary to have a chance to take the crown away from us.

Aargh wrote:This WSU team is probably stronger than both the 18-0 team 2 years ago and the 17-1 team last year.

I'm not seeing a Valley team likely to make the "Others Receiving Votes" lists. WSU could be a top-10 team from pre-season to post-season.

UNI, Evansville, and IlSU will get a bit more national attention than normal as the media watches those games to see if any Valley teams can take WSU down.

I know that all teams have off nights and all teams have hot nights. Generally, if a better team has an off night when a lesser team has a hot night, the lesser team claims the W. I don't see that happening in Valley play.

I'm not seeing more than 2 losses for WSU going into the NCAA's. Maybe one in the early tournament and maybe one in the Valley tourney. The Valley tourney doesn't matter to WSU. Their spot in the NCAA's will be solid before the tourney. The Shox might not even be playing for seeding at Arch Madness. Resting the players may be more important than winning games. Arch Madness might be a great place to get the Fr some experience.

Valley Tourney doesn't matter? Is that because WSU struggles in the valley tourney? I would hope a consistent top 10 team would be able to consistently win their conference tourney when other teams in the conference aren't consistently ranked. Arch Madness isn't a random preseason tourney.

I wouldn't say that Arch Madness doesn't matter, but WSU has received an auto bid 3 of the last 4 years and certainly would have in 2014 had we finished 33-1 instead of 34-0. The Shockers have not faired well in St Louis with only one championship in almost two decades, but it's very hard to beat three teams three times in one season. The Shockers have proven that out.

mathewson10 wrote:

Aargh wrote:This WSU team is probably stronger than both the 18-0 team 2 years ago and the 17-1 team last year.

I'm not seeing a Valley team likely to make the "Others Receiving Votes" lists. WSU could be a top-10 team from pre-season to post-season.

UNI, Evansville, and IlSU will get a bit more national attention than normal as the media watches those games to see if any Valley teams can take WSU down.

I know that all teams have off nights and all teams have hot nights. Generally, if a better team has an off night when a lesser team has a hot night, the lesser team claims the W. I don't see that happening in Valley play.

I'm not seeing more than 2 losses for WSU going into the NCAA's. Maybe one in the early tournament and maybe one in the Valley tourney. The Valley tourney doesn't matter to WSU. Their spot in the NCAA's will be solid before the tourney. The Shox might not even be playing for seeding at Arch Madness. Resting the players may be more important than winning games. Arch Madness might be a great place to get the Fr some experience.

Valley Tourney doesn't matter? Is that because WSU struggles in the valley tourney? I would hope a consistent top 10 team would be able to consistently win their conference tourney when other teams in the conference aren't consistently ranked. Arch Madness isn't a random preseason tourney.

So what Matthewson is saying is the MVC is such a bad conference, WSU should win every game including the Conference Championship and the Conference Tournament. We already carry the conference when we play OUtside the League (including the NCAA) and now we just cannot lose ever. That is logical.

shockalot wrote:I remain hopeful that Marty cuts loose from his game coaching pattern, one that was developed when he had sparse talent so needed to rely on a constant motion offense to free up "the" shooter, along with scratch, bump, and hold defense, just to try to stay competitive. It worked to a certain extent, but it is not a winning strategy, it is a survival strategy, not one to use when you actually have several talented players. I may be delusional but I think Marty might actually utilize his whole team's strengths this year and not hold them back. The Valley needs Evansville to rise to its potential this year and really be good. Probably not going to see another UNI type level performance, but if they could come close to that--and the talent is there to do it--that would make for at least a sliver of a chance that the Conference gets a second bid again. That would make most of us very happy. I for one don't want the Valley to be a one team show case ala Gonzaga, even if that team is my Shockers. I want my team to kick worthy asses in conference play, as well as suffer the occasional instructional loss from a ranked Valley opponent. Evansville, ISUR&B, UNI, Loyola, I'm talkin' to you and anybody else willing to make the kind of effort necessary to have a chance to take the crown away from us.

Excellent post, couldn't have said it better describing the Aces. Pretty much all Aces fans have said the same thing.

mathewson10 wrote:Valley Tourney doesn't matter? Is that because WSU struggles in the valley tourney? I would hope a consistent top 10 team would be able to consistently win their conference tourney when other teams in the conference aren't consistently ranked. Arch Madness isn't a random preseason tourney.

It matters but it's not as important to the rest of the league who needs it every year to get into the NCAA's. When one team knows where they're going in March and everybody else is fighting for their collective lives to get there in a weekend crapshoot, I'm sure you see why your reasoning is flawed.

I guess by your reasoning, the regular season, conference tourney, and NCAAs don't matter to Illinois State since they've struggled in those 3 areas for the better part of 2 decades.

Mock is probably the best post in the league and DJ is a heck of a shooter, but EU has to bring 5 + guys every night to win the league. So far, they haven't shown that kind of consistency or depth. It will be interesting to see how Simmons handles the team this year.

shockem wrote:Mock is probably the best post in the league and DJ is a heck of a shooter, but EU has to bring 5 + guys every night to win the league. So far, they haven't shown that kind of consistency or depth. It will be interesting to see how Simmons handles the team this year.

That's the weird part. It would appear that Marty has a roster built for consistency and depth. The two junior PGs are terribly under rated, partially because they split time, but mostly because they are over-shadowed by DJ. Mislav is a big wing that is ridiculously versatile. Wiley is a freak athlete PF, JC AA, and Wing and lil Simmons are nice role players. That should be enough horses in the stable to win a lot of games.