Who is the best MVC shooting guard?

[Cdizzle]

Sorry guys how dare I disagree with the almighty king of the basketball world wichita state shockers fan base. It is different playing 4-5 games when teams haven't seen you as much but playing 18+ games against those teams the stats may differ, they may not we'll never know. As for some guys I would put ahead of Baker: Caris LaVert, Wayne Selden, Malcolm Brogden, Marcus Foster. I would put Baker ahead of Harrison, I think Harrison's are overrated. So I'd have Baker at least 5th IMO. I think he's an excellent player all I've said is that he is not #2 in the nation like sportingnews said IMO

Nothing wrong with disagreeing, just trying to figure out on what you were basing your judgment. Here's a side-by-side comparison of the players you list. I think it's pretty clear that Selden is a cut below the other 4. His raw numbers, efficiencies, and peripheral stats are all considerably lower.

http://statsheet.com/mcb/players/compar ... cus-foster

After that, I would agree that LaVert, Brogdon, Foster and Baker make a good list, regardless of order. Baker has some efficiency and peripheral stat advantages in some places, but I could buy those equalizing against more consistent top-notch competition.

[mvcfan]

Sorry guys how dare I disagree with the almighty king of the basketball world wichita state shockers fan base. It is different playing 4-5 games when teams haven't seen you as much but playing 18+ games against those teams the stats may differ, they may not we'll never know. As for some guys I would put ahead of Baker: Caris LaVert, Wayne Selden, Malcolm Brogden, Marcus Foster. I would put Baker ahead of Harrison, I think Harrison's are overrated. So I'd have Baker at least 5th IMO. I think he's an excellent player all I've said is that he is not #2 in the nation like sportingnews said IMO

You forgot to mention Beane this time.

[Rollbird5]

Sorry guys how dare I disagree with the almighty king of the basketball world wichita state shockers fan base. It is different playing 4-5 games when teams haven't seen you as much but playing 18+ games against those teams the stats may differ, they may not we'll never know. As for some guys I would put ahead of Baker: Caris LaVert, Wayne Selden, Malcolm Brogden, Marcus Foster. I would put Baker ahead of Harrison, I think Harrison's are overrated. So I'd have Baker at least 5th IMO. I think he's an excellent player all I've said is that he is not #2 in the nation like sportingnews said IMO

You forgot to mention Beane this time.

The Siu fan said he'll be playing point guard

[Rollbird5]

Sorry guys how dare I disagree with the almighty king of the basketball world wichita state shockers fan base. It is different playing 4-5 games when teams haven't seen you as much but playing 18+ games against those teams the stats may differ, they may not we'll never know. As for some guys I would put ahead of Baker: Caris LaVert, Wayne Selden, Malcolm Brogden, Marcus Foster. I would put Baker ahead of Harrison, I think Harrison's are overrated. So I'd have Baker at least 5th IMO. I think he's an excellent player all I've said is that he is not #2 in the nation like sportingnews said IMO

Nothing wrong with disagreeing, just trying to figure out on what you were basing your judgment. Here's a side-by-side comparison of the players you list. I think it's pretty clear that Selden is a cut below the other 4. His raw numbers, efficiencies, and peripheral stats are all considerably lower.

http://statsheet.com/mcb/players/compar ... cus-foster

After that, I would agree that LaVert, Brogdon, Foster and Baker make a good list, regardless of order. Baker has some efficiency and peripheral stat advantages in some places, but I could buy those equalizing against more consistent top-notch competition.

I like that website never seen it definitely good for comparing players. When I compare I do look at stats some but I feel like stats can be misleading so I base my comparisons off seeing them play who they play and how they react to different situations as my main criteria.

[Wufan]

Sorry guys how dare I disagree with the almighty king of the basketball world wichita state shockers fan base. It is different playing 4-5 games when teams haven't seen you as much but playing 18+ games against those teams the stats may differ, they may not we'll never know. As for some guys I would put ahead of Baker: Caris LaVert, Wayne Selden, Malcolm Brogden, Marcus Foster. I would put Baker ahead of Harrison, I think Harrison's are overrated. So I'd have Baker at least 5th IMO. I think he's an excellent player all I've said is that he is not #2 in the nation like sportingnews said IMO

Nothing wrong with disagreeing, just trying to figure out on what you were basing your judgment. Here's a side-by-side comparison of the players you list. I think it's pretty clear that Selden is a cut below the other 4. His raw numbers, efficiencies, and peripheral stats are all considerably lower.

http://statsheet.com/mcb/players/compar ... cus-foster

After that, I would agree that LaVert, Brogdon, Foster and Baker make a good list, regardless of order. Baker has some efficiency and peripheral stat advantages in some places, but I could buy those equalizing against more consistent top-notch competition.

I like that website never seen it definitely good for comparing players. When I compare I do look at stats some but I feel like stats can be misleading so I base my comparisons off seeing them play who they play and how they react to different situations as my main criteria.

That's where it gets a little weird because Baker should pass the eye test. He's 6-3 or 6-4 and as strong as any 2 guard in the nation. He has a lightning quick release, good handles, gets to the basket, rebounds, takes care of the ball, has good vision, and is a good defender. He passes my eye test. I guess I'd like to see a little more athleticism.

What weaknesses do you see that make you think he's not a top 5 or 10 SG? If your argument is that he's not #2 but he's in your top 8, then I don't have an argument...it's too subjective at that level.

[Rollbird5]

That's where it gets a little weird because Baker should pass the eye test. He's 6-3 or 6-4 and as strong as any 2 guard in the nation. He has a lightning quick release, good handles, gets to the basket, rebounds, takes care of the ball, has good vision, and is a good defender. He passes my eye test. I guess I'd like to see a little more athleticism.

What weaknesses do you see that make you think he's not a top 5 or 10 SG? If your argument is that he's not #2 but he's in your top 8, then I don't have an argument...it's too subjective at that level.

I would have him in my top 8 as of now without seeing/counting any of the new freshman come in. Of all the guys who are in the discussion it will be interesting to see how they will fair this year because I think in most situations this year they will be the guy. Like now Baker will be the guy everyone will be zeroing in on as opposed to Early, same with Lavert and Brogden. I don't see many flaws in Baker's game he is solid everywhere. A good steady solid 2 guard that many teams wish they had. I think he is a great knock down shooter, i think his defense and could be better and his athleticism is good for mid-major level but can't match that of the big conference guys. We will see how good he can be now that he's the guy for wsu. I really hope he does do good (besides when playing my isu redbirds) cuz its good for the conference as a whole.

[Aargh]

Sorry, but Baker is not "the guy" for WSU. Other teams (and fans) might think that, and it will bite them. Cotton has been mostly known for his D, but his offensive game has been improving every year. I think VanVleet has shown that a defender can't cheat off of him an inch.

Then there's one Mr. Darius Carter. He's going to be demanding a double any time he touches within 10' of the hoop. How would you propose doubling Carter? Leaving any of the perimeter guys open is suicidal. Doubling Carter with the other post defender leaves a Shocker post unguarded. If there's a passing angle - there's a dunk. Marshall is a master of teaching passing angles.

[Rollbird5]

Sorry, but Baker is not "the guy" for WSU. Other teams (and fans) might think that, and it will bite them. Cotton has been mostly known for his D, but his offensive game has been improving every year. I think VanVleet has shown that a defender can't cheat off of him an inch.

Then there's one Mr. Darius Carter. He's going to be demanding a double any time he touches within 10' of the hoop. How would you propose doubling Carter? Leaving any of the perimeter guys open is suicidal. Doubling Carter with the other post defender leaves a Shocker post unguarded. If there's a passing angle - there's a dunk. Marshall is a master of teaching passing angles.

If I was a coach trying to defend them I would try to neutralize Van Vleet's penetration best as possible (easier said than done), and try to shut down baker. I would say my best chance to win would be to try to let cotton and carter beat me. I also don't know how your new guys will fit in or who's role will be what in regards to them so i can't really take into account how to guard them.

[Born2Shock]

Now thats a solid analysis.

[heartless]

MSU fan - here is my argument of Baker. I hate the guy! Translation I want him on my team.

As far as my bears, I could care less about how good individual players are. If we continue to play sieve defense it won't matter. No pressure scheme = 18 steals in 1300 minutes for Marshall.