Gregg Marshall stays at Wichita

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Re: Gregg Marshall stays at Wichita

Postby jwa123 » April 3rd, 2015, 2:16 pm

rlh04d wrote:
UNIFanSince1983 wrote:But that is the thing money wouldn't be the reason Marshall would leave WSU for one of those jobs. Obviously, he would get a bit of money for it, but that is not the reason coaches take those jobs.

The important thing is Marshall and Jacobsen appear to be staying put for now. That alone is a big win for each school and the conference as a whole.

One very interesting thing I learned about this: I'm fairly certain Marshall would be at Alabama right now if it was up to him. I think this decision is on his family. I have a feeling both of his kids campaigned hard to stay in Wichita. So in that sense, I'm not sure it would be about the prestige of those jobs, either. Marshall obviously values the opinions of his family very highly.

But they'll be out of school before too much longer, and I don't see them being around to talk Marshall out of taking one of those jobs if they come open in the next few years.

Still, there are maybe four jobs we could ever worry about losing Marshall to now. Kentucky, Florida, UNC, Duke. Who would ever expect that to be the limitations of what a coach would leave a Valley team for?


Speaks very positively to Gregg Marshall's character when he does what's more important for his family than what is best for his career.
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Re: Gregg Marshall stays at Wichita

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Re: Gregg Marshall stays at Wichita

Postby rlh04d » April 3rd, 2015, 3:15 pm

uniftw wrote:I'm not going to argue Marshall's worth to WSU...but with a 3.3mpy tag on his head anything less than a title in the next 3-5 years is sure to ultimately be deemed a failure and overpaying...as well as anything less than a s16/elite eight every single season on the way....right?

I could see why someone would have that opinion.

In my opinion, the limitations on Wichita State's program are the same whether they're paying Marshall $1 million or $10 million. They'd be the same limitations whether we have Marshall as our coach or Coach K. WSU will always struggle to get big name noncon opponents without taking buy games, will always struggle to get elite recruits, will always struggle to get conference games televised, and so on. His salary doesn't change that -- maybe with recruits, just because they know he's less likely to leave, but that's about it.

I think you have to look at Marshall's value to the university as being about more than athletics. WSU's success under Marshall hasn't just been about an NIT title/four straight NCAA appearances/Final Four/Undefeated Season/Sweet 16. It's also been about a vastly higher profile for the university, significantly higher enrollment, the Innovation Campus, the new dorm, significantly increased donations, and so on and so on. Which doesn't even get into the benefits to Wichita as a city, economic and otherwise. And none of that even touches on the athletic department.

I personally think that if Marshall ends up retiring at Wichita State, WSU is going to be used as a model throughout the nation of how a "smaller" university can use athletics to dramatically improve everything about it. Marshall is the publicity driver, but Dr. Bardo is probably just as important. Lots of universities increase their athletic profile through athletic publicity -- Dr. Bardo seems to have a strategic, aggressive desire to transform the university, enabled by athletic publicity.

And while I'm obviously not an independent observer, I'm not a Wichita State alumni, either. Ultimately what Wichita State does as a university, independent of the athletic department, doesn't matter that much to me. But I'm very impressed with the moves WSU has made as a university in the last several years. The groundwork has been laid to transform WSU into something very different.

But ... I think if you look at Marshall's salary as a driver for the improvements towards the university as a whole, and as a way to continuously drive attention to the university and build the loyalty that's needed to drive donations to fund university improvements, I really don't think the athletics themselves are that important. WSU will just want Marshall to keep doing what he's been doing: win at a level that continuously keeps WSU in the news. A national championship would absolutely do that, but so would regular Sweet 16 runs. No question, though, WSU wants a national championship, and that's a possibility now.

I'm not sure I agree with the number just because it seems so astronomical, but WSU's study estimated the university received $571 million in advertising just from the Final Four run alone. That's Marshall's new salary for the next 173 years. If that number is even ten times what WSU actually made, $57.1 million is still probably more than Marshall will make from WSU in his career, even with this new contract, and doesn't account for the publicity of these last two years, and any future publicity.

And hell, WSU's last several years are even more impressive given the state of Kansas politics. Donations are going to be more and more important to the university itself given declining state funds.

I don't live in Wichita anymore and haven't in some time ... but when I go back, the city is different than I remember it. There's more of a swagger around town, and there's more pride in the city itself. You can legitimately make the argument that Marshall is transforming Wichita.

IMO, basketball success is the third most important part of Marshall's job.
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Re: Gregg Marshall stays at Wichita

Postby AndShock » April 3rd, 2015, 4:25 pm

rlh04d wrote:I don't live in Wichita anymore and haven't in some time ... but when I go back, the city is different than I remember it. There's more of a swagger around town, and there's more pride in the city itself. You can legitimately make the argument that Marshall is transforming Wichita.


This is something that I absolutely love about Gregg that is very hard to explain to outsiders and they don't even believe it when I do. Heck, some Wichita State fans probably don't even believe it. There is a buzz around this town that just didn't exist 10 years ago and imo you can't put a dollar figure on it. Combined with everything else you said, if Gregg was the highest paid coach in college basketball I wouldn't be complaining. When Gregg is gone, either by retirement or another job, we might be able to find someone who is just as good of a coach, maybe even better. We will never find another Gregg Marshall. I know that sounds cliche and ridiculous and it might sound like I'm only saying it because he's our coach, but it is 100% true.
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Re: Gregg Marshall stays at Wichita

Postby rlh04d » April 3rd, 2015, 4:26 pm

Tl;dr didn't read version:

The #4 richest man in the United States isn't personally involved just because he likes basketball.
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Re: Gregg Marshall stays at Wichita

Postby Wufan » April 3rd, 2015, 4:52 pm

uniftw wrote:I'm not going to argue Marshall's worth to WSU...but with a 3.3mpy tag on his head anything less than a title in the next 3-5 years is sure to ultimately be deemed a failure and overpaying...as well as anything less than a s16/elite eight every single season on the way....right?


No. I will be disappointed every year that we don't make the tournament, and some Shocker fans will be irrate, but that is part of rooting for a non-blue chip program. Marshall has won 30 games a year for the past three years and has averaged 30 wins per game for the past 5, with none of those being below 27. He's won 25 or more games per year for the past 6 years (only been here 8). He owns the top five winningest seasons in WSU history since 1928 (when WSU went 33-8) and the #1, 3,4,5,6, 10 winningest seasons all time.

He has a 7 year contract. I expect 5 tournament appearances, 2 sweet 16s. Anything beyond that is gravy!
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Re: Gregg Marshall stays at Wichita

Postby ShoxNAwe » April 3rd, 2015, 5:38 pm

uniftw wrote: I'm not going to argue Marshall's worth to WSU...but with a 3.3mpy tag on his head anything less than a title in the next 3-5 years is sure to ultimately be deemed a failure and overpaying...as well as anything less than a s16/elite eight every single season on the way....right?


Wrong. Look at the hundreds of millions in advertising value and real dollars that Marshall has drawn to WSU over the last 5 years. Even a repeat of past performance is enough.
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Re: Gregg Marshall stays at Wichita

Postby bleach » April 3rd, 2015, 7:16 pm

As a fan of a team that I believe has the potential to be where WSU is, I know the value of a great coach to a program. As a non WSU fan, I think most of the mid major barriers have been knocked down by WSU and they only go back up if you let them. Losing Gregg would have put many back up.
That said, I expect WSU to maintain expectations of NCAA tourney every year (barring major uncontrollable factors), sweet sixteen at least 50% of the time and better every 4-5 years. I would also expect that success rate to improve over time.
Success breeds success. Don't be content! Gregg won't be.
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Re: Gregg Marshall stays at Wichita

Postby Kyle » April 3rd, 2015, 9:38 pm

Expecting a NC in the next 7 years is completely unreasonable for ANY program not named Kentucky, Duke, North Carolina, or Kansas.

National Championships are a once in lifetime type deal for great programs and a once in a decade type deal for the BEST programs.
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Re: Gregg Marshall stays at Wichita

Postby Championz » April 4th, 2015, 1:35 pm

uniftw wrote:I'm not going to argue Marshall's worth to WSU...but with a 3.3mpy tag on his head anything less than a title in the next 3-5 years is sure to ultimately be deemed a failure and overpaying...as well as anything less than a s16/elite eight every single season on the way....right?


This post has an incredible amount of fail in it.

Thankfully, a lot of that has been cleared up by other posters already.
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Re: Gregg Marshall stays at Wichita

Postby Rollbird5 » April 4th, 2015, 2:19 pm

It'll be interesting to see how wsu is once fred, ron, and evan are gone. Those 3 are some of the biggest competitors/winners I have ever watched, will be tough to replace them. I don't know as much about wsu's history, so I'm sure you guys have wondered the same thing about other players/teams in the past and it ended up working out well obviously.
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